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  1. #1
    Forum Dinosaur ไดโนเสาร์ Flip's Avatar
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    Default Interesting People you Meet in Airports

    Last year I went to the Formula 1 Abu Dhabi Grand Prix. F1 is my passion but I've never been to a race and I promised myself I would - its a bucket list thing. It was awesome - you actually get to see more on TV but the whole atmosphere thing can't be obtained by watching a screen.

    I had a few hours to kill before my flight back to Manchester and spent them in the lounge at Abu Dhabi. There I met a very flamboyant, obviously gay asian guy who was wearing furry slippers and spoke with a super posh English accent. I also had a chat with a guy who was part of the Mercedes F1 team and was carrying Lewis Hamilton's and Valtteri Bottas's helmets to a promotional event in Malayasia. Apparently they can't carry them themselves .

    But by far the most interesting person was an investigator who works for UK immigration and was on his way back from Pakistan. From the stories he told me, its hardly surprising that its getting harder for people to bring their Thai spouse to the UK.

    I'm sorry to say it but he was very very clear about which group of people are responsible for the tightening up of immigration laws. You guessed it - our South Asian bretheren. Grandma's arriving on visit visas and someone else going home in their place. Men who've brought in 10+ wives etc. etc. In going about his job he sometimes has occasion to meet up with Benefits Agency fraud and Inland Revenue investigators. He reckoned the scale of benefit fraud going on amongst Pakistani communities is mind blowing and they make little contribution to the country's tax revenue.

    Apparently, before the tightening up of regulations - one successful Pakistani male immigrant would eventually lead to a lot more applications. First the guy marries another Pakistan resident, she just happens to have 2 kids. Then he needs to bring his elderly parents across as they can't take care of themselves. His wife then also needed to bring her parents across. They then divorced and the whole process started again.

    I'm not surprised we are where we are now - these people must cost the country an absolute fortune. All of the Thai immigrants I've known work, pay taxes and generally make a positive contribution to the UK. They don't demand Thai speaking teachers and don't have their own courts, punishing Thai's under Thai law. I've never heard of the building of a Thai temple in the UK being partly financed by a government grant or seen any government documents printed in Thai. Before the language requirement many of these Pakistani immigrants could not speak a word of English which must have cost the UK a fortune whereas most Thai immigrants could at least speak basic English.

    It seems unfair but I guess they can't discriminate between groups - what I learned has certainly changed my thinking on immigration and I'm sorry to say, my attitude towards a certain group of people.

    I'm not at all racist in any way but I'm also not afraid to say what I feel when I learn of ANY group of people who abuse this country's liberal ways and caring society.

  2. #2
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    i mentioned before the war wasnt over ,,and was misunderstood ,i have to be carfull what i say ,otherwise i will be branded like cattle , The labour party knows and if you vote for them your a idiot .

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flip View Post
    Last year I went to the Formula 1 Abu Dhabi Grand Prix. F1 is my passion but I've never been to a race and I promised myself I would - its a bucket list thing. It was awesome - you actually get to see more on TV but the whole atmosphere thing can't be obtained by watching a screen.

    I had a few hours to kill before my flight back to Manchester and spent them in the lounge at Abu Dhabi. There I met a very flamboyant, obviously gay asian guy who was wearing furry slippers and spoke with a super posh English accent. I also had a chat with a guy who was part of the Mercedes F1 team and was carrying Lewis Hamilton's and Valtteri Bottas's helmets to a promotional event in Malayasia. Apparently they can't carry them themselves .

    But by far the most interesting person was an investigator who works for UK immigration and was on his way back from Pakistan. From the stories he told me, its hardly surprising that its getting harder for people to bring their Thai spouse to the UK.

    I'm sorry to say it but he was very very clear about which group of people are responsible for the tightening up of immigration laws. You guessed it - our South Asian bretheren. Grandma's arriving on visit visas and someone else going home in their place. Men who've brought in 10+ wives etc. etc. In going about his job he sometimes has occasion to meet up with Benefits Agency fraud and Inland Revenue investigators. He reckoned the scale of benefit fraud going on amongst Pakistani communities is mind blowing and they make little contribution to the country's tax revenue.

    Apparently, before the tightening up of regulations - one successful Pakistani male immigrant would eventually lead to a lot more applications. First the guy marries another Pakistan resident, she just happens to have 2 kids. Then he needs to bring his elderly parents across as they can't take care of themselves. His wife then also needed to bring her parents across. They then divorced and the whole process started again.

    I'm not surprised we are where we are now - these people must cost the country an absolute fortune. All of the Thai immigrants I've known work, pay taxes and generally make a positive contribution to the UK. They don't demand Thai speaking teachers and don't have their own courts, punishing Thai's under Thai law. I've never heard of the building of a Thai temple in the UK being partly financed by a government grant or seen any government documents printed in Thai. Before the language requirement many of these Pakistani immigrants could not speak a word of English which must have cost the UK a fortune whereas most Thai immigrants could at least speak basic English.

    It seems unfair but I guess they can't discriminate between groups - what I learned has certainly changed my thinking on immigration and I'm sorry to say, my attitude towards a certain group of people.

    I'm not at all racist in any way but I'm also not afraid to say what I feel when I learn of ANY group of people who abuse this country's liberal ways and caring society.
    and im sorry to say its to late thank god i wont be here .

  3. #3

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    If you'd asked something simple such as: What is the meaning of life the Universe and everything, I could tell you the answer is 42.

    Here, as we don't have seven and a half million years, I would hazard a guess and say the answer is 1997.
    The clock on the wall reads a quarter past midnight

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    Quote Originally Posted by marshall View Post
    If you'd asked something simple such as: What is the meaning of life the Universe and everything, I could tell you the answer is 42.

    Here, as we don't have seven and a half million years, I would hazard a guess and say the answer is 1997.
    But "Don't Panic", maybe we should ask the mice

  5. #5
    Forum Dinosaur ไดโนเสาร์ caller's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flip View Post
    I'm sorry to say it but he was very very clear about which group of people are responsible for the tightening up of immigration laws. You guessed it - our South Asian bretheren. Grandma's arriving on visit visas and someone else going home in their place. Men who've brought in 10+ wives etc. etc. In going about his job he sometimes has occasion to meet up with Benefits Agency fraud and Inland Revenue investigators. He reckoned the scale of benefit fraud going on amongst Pakistani communities is mind blowing and they make little contribution to the country's tax revenue.
    That's quite a sweeping statement he has made about Pakistani's and benefit fraud. But good to see Immigration are still continuing to work with other agencies again. In the past they have been part of the problem, not the solution as it was some numpty's idea to pretty much stop co-operating with others and although that had changed before I retired, the average immigration investigators were still being shackled by their bosses.

    I recall in London, back in the late 80's to maybe early 1992, working with them on a regular basis on some very large jobs and it all went very well, but they just simply didn't have the resources to cope (and still don't). I witnessed many suspected immigration offenders being arrested and then released simply because no-one was free from immigration to attend at the Police Station. In the end the Police refused to arrest them in the first place and have to go through the whole rigmarole of booking them in etc. before just letting them go again. That has never really changed.

    And I could tell you about some very serious benefit frauds that no-one now really investigates.

    I could also mention that during the latter years of Thatcher's Govt. the team I worked for based in Central London, were told to stop advising employers what checks they should be making on prospective employees - really basic stuff, such as not accepting photocopied documents and the like, because the view was that illegal or not, their earning contributed to the economy in the way of spending, VAT raised and so on. That actually had limited merit as much was sent abroad and I would say that time was the start of the race to the bottom in respect of pay for unskilled labour.
    Last edited by caller; 27th Apr 2018 at 16:40.
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  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by caller View Post

    I recall in London, back in the late 80's to maybe early 1992, working with them on a regular basis on some very large jobs and it all went very well, but they just simply didn't have the resources to cope (and still don't). I witnessed many suspected immigration offenders being arrested and then released simply because no-one was free from immigration to attend at the Police Station. In the end the Police refused to arrest them in the first place and have to go through the whole rigmarole of booking them in etc. before just letting them go again. That has never really changed.

    And I could tell you about some very serious benefit frauds that no-one now really investigates.
    Would you say this is politically motivated, or more a case of a department being overwhelmed with the scope of the problem?
    The clock on the wall reads a quarter past midnight

  7. #7
    Forum Dinosaur ไดโนเสาร์ Flip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by caller View Post
    That's quite a sweeping statement he has made about Pakistani's and benefit fraud.
    Well as he was immigration I guess he was parting with knowledge he'd gained from working with the benefits people.

    On the subject of immigration I asked him if they had many immigration related problems with Thais. He said very few compared to other groups - the main things being overstayers and people trying to travel on other people's passports. Apparently the main culprits are females between 20-30 who he reckoned were working or trying to work in the UK's red light industry.

  8. #8
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    It seems crazy to me how a blind eye, leniency or incompetence comes in to it in so many areas and then the ones that stick to the rules are the ones to suffer. Just on the news tonight was the serial offender that did a hit and run in Coventry that killed 2 boys whilst driving a car that he shouldn't of been. He has been sentenced to 9 years and the woman in the car who was with him and assaulted a member of the public whilst trying to flee was given 6 months! When we were down in Reading, 2 cyclists got killed by a repeat offender while he was fleeing from the Police in a car he should not have been driving, I think he got 10 years, we knew one of the families involved and left without a father for their children.

    I work with a lot of Pakistanis and the good ones hate what their fellow countrymen are getting up to and the affect it also has on them, some themselves are also being "exploited" by others, but just brush it under the carpet or do nothing about it, it seems like if there were any reporting then they would be the ones targeted rather than the ones being reported! Same goes for other nationalities too.

    I wish they would go harsh on those committing the crimes and hope the ripple effect takes effect, I would also actually go one step further and add forced sterilisation to those serial offenders, might also help with child poverty and abuse, as well as a 3 or 5 strikes rule to start making the criminals the real victims of the crimes they are committing, might stop this sort of ridiculous situation:-
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukn...nvictions.html

    Also with those that are caught illegal and then let go subject to reporting or can't be returned to their country of residence I would arrange for daily visits to their associated embassies where they can be paraded in chains every day until that country gets their act together or gets fed up with all the clanking outside their doors.

    In the meantime we can all carry on paying increased fees, feeling at risk of crime, paying increased insurance costs, no go areas, overburdened NHS and wondering if we should turn to crime when times are hard as it seems to pay dividends with limited consequences.
    Last edited by KhunIanB-UK; 27th Apr 2018 at 23:47.

  9. #9
    Forum Regular สมาชิกประจำ Big AL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flip View Post
    Grandma's arriving on visit visas and someone else going home in their place.

    Impersonation is much more common in some cultures than we might imagine. I heard of a Brit marrying a Thai woman. Part of the deal was that she would bring in some nephews and nieces, pretending that they were her children.

    Some people use other people's passports/visas.

    A few years ago a Filipino male nurse was convicted of killing numerous patients in Manchester by giving them high doses of insulin. Very little coverage was given to the fact that it came to light that he had got someone else to do some of his nursing exams for him. By getting the qualification he was able to work as a nurse and get a job in the UK, complete with visa. It also meant that he was able to kill a lot of people......

    It has happened with ESOL exams needed for visas/citizenship. It has happened for driving tests.

    Doctors, dentists, opticians, pharmacists. Did they all do all the exams that they should have done?

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    Forum Dinosaur ไดโนเสาร์ caller's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flip View Post
    Well as he was immigration I guess he was parting with knowledge he'd gained from working with the benefits people.
    I suspect it would have been more accurate if he referenced the problem in relation to where there are large gatherings of Pakistani's - there aren't that many of them when compared to the rest of the population. And for the last 20 years of my career, where I worked in one of the most ethnically diverse areas of the Country, I did manage a benefit investigation team, amongst other things.

    - - - - - - - u p d a t e d - - - - - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by marshall View Post
    Would you say this is politically motivated, or more a case of a department being overwhelmed with the scope of the problem?
    To a degree, neither. It's far more complicated than just a straightforward either / or. But certainly when I mentioned the late 80's, immigration at that time were required to seek the express permission of the secretary of state if it was expected that more than 5 immigration offenders were to be arrested. That was merely a case of old rules that needed updating and an ignorance of the true scale of the problem. I didn't even work for immigration, but we could do that almost daily.
    'Tis me

  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by caller View Post
    To a degree, neither. It's far more complicated than just a straightforward either / or. But certainly when I mentioned the late 80's, immigration at that time were required to seek the express permission of the secretary of state if it was expected that more than 5 immigration offenders were to be arrested. That was merely a case of old rules that needed updating and an ignorance of the true scale of the problem. I didn't even work for immigration, but we could do that almost daily.
    I was presuming you were there around the early 2000's, I'm sure decisions made around this time were highly politically motivated - as 'you' couldn't openly criticise policy without being automatically labelled (Gillian Duffy), and shamed into silence.


    Flip please don't think I'm picking on you but a few months back you spoke of your distaste for nationalism. Many saw future problems building many years before you had a talk with an immigration officer, recently having lived where the effects were more keenly felt.
    Considering human nature what else can people do to try and remedy a situation they feel powerless to control, and where no one is listening to them? I read in a news article recently that the police didn't publish their findings, and worse failed to act on them, for over a decade because they didn't want to: give ammunition to the right.

    With regards to your thoughts on the main media, please consider that they hardly ever mention certain topics that everyone else can't stop talking about. If you were to read on many other news websites the scope of public feeling would be impossible to deny, and one question that is often posted by readers is will this news story be published in such and such website, to which most know the answer is no it won't: conspicuous by it's absence.
    I know some of my posts have been more like rants, and for that I'm sorry, but I have seen things drastically change in over only a few decades, everything (institutions) to me seem broken and presided over by people who seem utterly intransigent in their ways and at odds to the publics mood.

    I have been posting snippets of news and such about incidents which happened in the last century hoping to build a picture to how the powers operate, and the west have always been seen to be masters of the 'hidden hand', not so much by us who are not always privy to the real facts but to the people who live overseas in countries that unfortunately for them harbour great riches.
    Last edited by marshall; 29th Apr 2018 at 00:39. Reason: grammar, punctuation
    The clock on the wall reads a quarter past midnight

  12. #12
    Forum Dinosaur ไดโนเสาร์ Flip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marshall View Post
    Flip please don't think I'm picking on you but a few months back you spoke of your distaste for nationalism. Many saw future problems building many years before you had a talk with an immigration officer, recently having lived where the effects were more keenly felt.
    Considering human nature what else can people do to try and remedy a situation they feel powerless to control, and where no one is listening to them? I read in a news article recently that the police didn't publish their findings, and worse failed to act on them, for over a decade because they didn't want to: give ammunition to the right.
    I don't see that nationalism and my complaints about the Pakistani community as the same Marshall. I welcome anyone of any colour or creed to come and live in England (apart from the fact that its full but the sentiment remains). However, I do not believe in multiculturalism - we've had that rammed down our throats for far too long. At the risk of being branded racist, I'll tell you exactly what I think of the Pakistani community and although there may be some who are different - I think this goes for most of them. Whether they class themselves as moderate or radical muslims, at best their culture is not compatible with that of the UK.

    They live their entire life by their religious beliefs. Religion governs their laws, their politics, their schooling, relationships........and on and on - their every waking moment is consumed by their religion. The most radical amongst them believe that we are the devil incarnate for living our lives differently and those linked to groups such as Isis go as far as to preach death to anyone, even other muslims who does not believe in their particular skewed brand of Islam. Quite how those who preach 'multiculturalism' think that's ever going to go hand in hand with the way we live our lives is beyond my capability to fathom.

    I have friends living in the UK that are Jamaican, they have no problem intergrating in to the British way of life, I have a Tunisian friend, herself a muslim, I don't see much difference between the way she lives her life and the way I live mine. In fact, I've just got back from Wolverhampton where I went to watch her fight in a Muay Thai competition - can you see a Pakistani muslim woman doing that? I don't think Pakistanis want to integrate into British society, I think they want to take it over. For years we've been bending over to their demands, in some areas minarets are now more common than church towers. Whilst we've been busy building our wonderful 'multicultural society' some members of the muslim community have been busy building bombs that they've placed in our transport hubs and even at pop concerts. Their loyalty is not to the UK, its not even to Pakistan, its to Islam and they see the UK as one of Islam's enemies - how can we live with people like that?

    As for nationalism, by that I mean the type of nationalism that thinks we should 'look after our own first' and let all those scrounging refugees take their chances. People who preach racial hatred based purely on the colour of someone's skin. People who think the UK can survive in today's world on its own, without forging alliances with others. In short, Hitlers brand of nationalism - ultra right wing nationalist groups are on the increase across Europe. Some of our newer political parties have their roots in such nationalism but have modified their behaviour in public so as to increase their chances of political success. Should they ever achieve any form of political power, they will revert I'm sure and who they really are will become clear.

    I could go on and on on this subject but I'll just explain my thinking on one of the comments I made above. I believe in compassion to my fellow man, no matter where he comes from. If he's in trouble, I would offer him shelter. A refugee is a refugee and may well need help. But do I think we should give refugees a passport and let them live in our society? No, I don't - as I've said on other threads many times, the UK is full. Do I think we should offer a genuine refugee some form of temporary shelter? Absolutely! In recent years various EU members have been fighting over who should take how many of the seemingly endless numbers of refugees coming over the sea from Africa - why? When they say take, they mean permanently. Why?

    So yes Marshall, I don't like what's going on in our Pakistani mulsim society and I also don't like nationalism - I don't see the conflict. Nationalsim and Patriotism are not the same thing.
    Last edited by Flip; 29th Apr 2018 at 02:33.

  13. #13
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    i live in a large asian community and i can tell you the holy war or crusades never ended and is still being fought a jihad holy war not fought by swords or other weapons ,but by destroying from the inside out ,ie churches being knocked down mosque built in there place towns being left to rot luton bradford halifax bolton blackburn burnley house prices down pubs shut and slums created ,drug pushing ,bombings ,stabbings,money laundering ie how many kebab houses and how many taxis ,cash buisness ,politicains in high places gang rapes and grooming gangs ,48 years old am i and i have lived with them all my life ,they dont mix and thats a fact only last week i went into the bank and 2 women walked in with just there eyes showing ,maybe they wernt women who knows ,25 per cent they say then the swords and knives come out and its growing at a alarming rate ,what is it in south thailand over 5000 deaths in the last 14 years ,its world wide ,its a war a jihad ive a nice big jar of kenco here you can smell it or put your rose tinted glasses on if you want buts its coming and coming quick .NON beliver =infidel

  14. #14

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    Seen many celebs over the years but the funniest was literally standing in the toilet urinals close to Aeroflot final gate alongside that fella who was heavily featured from them on the Airport series on bbc in the 90's. Cant think of his name but he was even smaller then he appeared on tv. I was racking up different airlines and they had a new 777 delivered which had the smallest economy seats known to man. Never again

    Edited Jeremy Spake
    Last edited by wunderbar; 29th Apr 2018 at 08:24.

  15. #15
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    We flew from Bangkok to Hong Kong to go to Disneyland on Emirates A380 and there was a Thai guy at the airport that seemed a bit out of place and acting a bit strangely to me, he was wearing sun glasses to hide his identity and had an obvious colleague, but were acting like they were not "together". I pointed this out to Aom and she thought she recognised him from Thai TV. I went over to him whilst he was sitting down by a charging point and had a quick chat with him, he was from Thai TV and the other guy was his "minder" and they were also off to Hong Kong for business. I mentioned that my wife recognised him and would he mind if she come over to see him, he agreed and they had a chat, Aom was like the cat that got the cream especially with getting a "selfie" too :-) Ends up on boarding that they had the row in front of us (economy) and he was directly in front of me, Aom was all excited over him being there, but as I had the window seat I wasn't going to switch.

    What really surprised me about him though was the Clark Kent/Superman style transition though when he took of his sunglasses and stood up at the end of the flight, there was then immediate recognition from all the other Thais on the flight and he was swamped! Up until that point he had remained completely unrecognised even though he and minder, by their attempts to remain "incognito", made me notice them even more so, and initially I thought they might be up to no good.

    His name was pronounced something like Guy Samapon.

    Apart from him, on the hundreds of flights I have done have never spoken to anyone of recognition at airport or on flight.

    The closest I think I have got was in the Hotels Executive Lounge of the Mumbai Marriot where there was a rather portly Indian Guru who got chatting to and gave him some assistance with some wordings that he was putting together along the lines of leading a good life without the trappings of money, as part of our conversation I pointed out the little bit of hypocrisy of our location and lavishness, his answer was that he had been "poor" once so knew what he was talking about, at the end of the conversation he then treated me to a bottle of red wine that cost hundreds and was served up by a Nepalese Prince who's father he knew, he also gave me a signed copy of a book he had written.

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    On the subject of people from the sub-continent I had in the past three month to terminate over 20 employees from India all of whom had lied on job applications and/or had had others do telephone interviews on their behalf. In my industry this kind of fraud can easily cost lives so right now when interviewing I am having to work doubly hard to not display bias with new applicants of indian origin.
    Human beings are seventy percent water, and with some the rest is collagen

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flip View Post
    I believe in compassion to my fellow man, no matter where he comes from.

    I didn't want to go into the different merits of each culture, I just want people in power to rule with common sense and consider the impact decisions made 'today' will have on our future.
    Driving around in my job down here in the South all I see is housing estates being built with no sign of let up, has anyone done a study on whether the roads can handle the yearly increase?


    Yesterday I dropped my keys while out walking, didn't realise until I got back to my car. I retraced my steps in haste wondering how I was going to get back to work and considered smashing a window. Couldn't see my keys but as I got nearer back I asked a guy if he'd seen any keys, he replied yes the two behind me have picked them up. walking towards me two black guys were smiling and I asked them if they'd found my keys, Yes they had them! I insisted they took a small reward as they'd saved me a lot of money and hassle, but they wouldn't think of taking money from me, and I was quite insistant. The guy who picked them up just said if I found his keys one day I could keep them safe for him! Really nice guy and I thanked him.
    So please don't think I consider one culture better than another I am simply concerned on the question of space and how we all need to be housed, watered and cared for - and note how taxes keep going up to pay for the ever increasing load.
    The clock on the wall reads a quarter past midnight

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    Forum Dinosaur ไดโนเสาร์ caller's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marshall View Post
    I was presuming you were there around the early 2000's, I'm sure decisions made around this time were highly politically motivated - as 'you' couldn't openly criticise policy without being automatically labelled (Gillian Duffy), and shamed into silence.
    By 2000 I had been working in Local Government for 7-years. I personally never once suffered any interference in my time there in respect of the work our team was doing and we exposed some stuff that wasn't easy for the authority to stomach. We were always given full backing.

    For example, when identifying frauds involving staff members and irrespective of creed or nationality, they were always dealt with in accordance with Council regs and / or the law, as appropriate. In some cases, when staff were suspected of being immigration offenders, because we really didn't know their true identity or where they were actually living (despite our best efforts), arrangements were made to arrest them upon arrival at work.

    I personally only ever had one instance where I was directly involved in a case, where an employee was treated inexcusably favourably because of her race and I think I have already mentioned that here. That was, I don't know, circa 83/84 when I was employed in Central Government.
    Last edited by caller; 29th Apr 2018 at 16:58.
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    Quote Originally Posted by caller View Post
    By 2000 I had been working in Local Government for 7-years. I personally never once suffered any interference in my time there in respect of the work our team was doing and we exposed some stuff that wasn't easy for the authority to stomach. We were always given full backing.

    For example, when identifying frauds involving staff members and irrespective of creed or nationality, they were always dealt with in accordance with Council regs and / or the law, as appropriate. In some cases, when staff were suspected of being immigration offenders, because we really didn't know their true identity or where they were actually living (as opposed to where they claimed), arrangements were made to arrest them upon arrival at work.

    I personally only ever had one instance where I was directly involved in a case, where an employee was treated inexcusably favourably because of her race and I think I have already mentioned that here. That was, I don't know, circa 83/84 when I was employed in Central Government.

    - - - - - - - u p d a t e d - - - - - - -

    Not a conversation, but I once watched in fascination, Richard Gere meditating at Tokyo's Narita Airport, back in March or April 2005. He looked very calm!
    I admit all I know is what I read on-line, so now I know there are bodies that are functioning as they should, that's good to know as I've long held the view that often the heads of departments were making sure some groups were favoured over others.
    Your job sounds very interesting caller I wonder if you miss it? Though I think you've said that your work got harder towards retirement due to people above you.
    The clock on the wall reads a quarter past midnight

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