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MrDick
27th Feb 2007, 09:33
Hello all,

Its taken me a while to find this site but I've already picked up some invaluable information from previous threads.

My particular predicament is as follows. I have been involved with a Thai girl since Feb 2006 and have travelled to see her another three times since. She is now pregnant expecting the baby in August. I will have been separated for two years on June 1st at which point divorce proceedings will commence. We intend to marry when possible - probably after the birth - and to set up home in UK. Out of consideration to both our families we will have the birth take place in Thailand. The questions arising from this situation are as follows;
Given that I am registered as father on the birth certificate will the baby be eligible for UK passport and thus not require a visa?
I intend to be in Thailand for the birth and could marry at this time if my divorce has been settled. If not can anyone foresee any potential problems regarding a fiance visa - given that we have all the history and documentation?

I own my house and am self employed and can support mother and child.

Look forward to your comments,

Dick

MrDick
27th Feb 2007, 09:33
Hello all,

Its taken me a while to find this site but I've already picked up some invaluable information from previous threads.

My particular predicament is as follows. I have been involved with a Thai girl since Feb 2006 and have travelled to see her another three times since. She is now pregnant expecting the baby in August. I will have been separated for two years on June 1st at which point divorce proceedings will commence. We intend to marry when possible - probably after the birth - and to set up home in UK. Out of consideration to both our families we will have the birth take place in Thailand. The questions arising from this situation are as follows;
Given that I am registered as father on the birth certificate will the baby be eligible for UK passport and thus not require a visa?
I intend to be in Thailand for the birth and could marry at this time if my divorce has been settled. If not can anyone foresee any potential problems regarding a fiance visa - given that we have all the history and documentation?

I own my house and am self employed and can support mother and child.

Look forward to your comments,

Dick

Chris4Cat
27th Feb 2007, 09:58
I think that somewhere in this forum it was suggested that you also register and get a THAI passport/citizenship for your newborn - so that s/he can take advantage in later years (inheritance / work / settlement) of being a dual national if s/he decides to move back to Thailand when all grown up.

This is right, anybody?

Christopher

Lucky
27th Feb 2007, 10:28
Hi Dick

Yes, the baby is entitled to a UK passport and as Chris says also get the baby a Thai passport. Dual nationality is accepted by both countries. I doubt you will get a settlement visa until your divorce is finalised and you have the paperwork to prove it. If you search this site you will find lots on the pros and cons of marrying in Thailand or the UK. Personally I think it is easier and cheaper to marry in Thailand and also as soon as your wife arrives in the UK if you are already married official paerwork is much simpler.

Looking ahead don't forget that after a couple of years she will require ILR to remain in the UK so keep up to date with what is a rapidly changing set of rules!

Chris4Cat
27th Feb 2007, 10:38
Also, when you apply for the visa make sure the dates give you enough time to book a flight and arrive back in the UK because whilst it may be cheaper to marry over there, if her two year residence is not within the two years from the visa being ISSUED by the Embassy, you may have to pay for another FLR before you can get you ILR. Make it absolutely clear on the application when you want the visa to start. It starts when it's ISSUED/DATED in Bangkok and NOT when you ARRIVE back in the UK.

I applied for a fianceé visa to marry in England and we now have six months to get married and apply for the FLR settlement visa.

Christopher

ian allcock
27th Feb 2007, 10:45
Hi Dick

i too have been going down the divorce route from an english girl,recieved my decree nisi on 6 feb now have to wait 6 weeks and 1 day until applicant (the ex) can apply for the decree absolute.Please note no absolute no visa as you have to show evidence that you are fre to marry.
why are you waiting for 2 years until starting divorce procedings not being nosey just trying to help.

Chris4Cat
27th Feb 2007, 11:19
Is it two years separation means you can get divorced - even if your ex doesn't want to?

ian allcock
27th Feb 2007, 11:35
Hi Chris its 2 years unless you can prove reasonable grounds for divorce i.e adultery or abuse without going into detail she left me (no children involved) and filed for divorce after 3 months seperation accused me of allsorts so i agreed and it only took 1 year start to finish of course she told complete pack of lies and i had to swallow my pride and agree that bit hurt but worth it for quick result hope that helps

Ian and Wi :)

MrDick
27th Feb 2007, 11:41
Thanks for the prompt replies.

Advice on dual nationality makes good sense.
I assume that on the visa application you can name the date you want the visa to start from, am I right?

With regard to the divorce, I know it would make sense to go for earlier settlement but for the sake of my British family I don't want to create any ill feeling. The benefits of waiting a few months will probably be worth it. Also, for the sake of Vicky's family it could be their only chance to see the baby for some time.

Chris4Cat
27th Feb 2007, 12:15
It asks you when you want the visa to start on the application form - and that's when the visa starts from NOT when she enters the UK. They don't stamp her passport like what you are probably used to. The visa is a big sticker that takes up a whole page of the passport with a photograph and hologram. It clearly states when the visa is valid from, the nature of the visa and when she should return (for VV). On Cat's passport it says that she has a Fianceé visa and the name (me) of the person she will marry.

rolyshark
27th Feb 2007, 14:46
Just so you're clear,as the thread is not,the grounds for divorce are-
1-the marriage has irretrievably broken down, and
2-one of the following;
i-adultery (hers,not yours!)
ii-unreasonable behaviour
iii-separation for 2 years with consent
iv-separation for 5 years if no consent
v-desertion

You may only obtain a divorce if you have been married for 12 months.

So,basically,unless your wife consents or you can show her adultery/unreasonable behaviour,you will have to wait 5 years. Separation generally means that you have lived apart,or maintained separate households,for a continuous period with no resumption of cohabitation within that period.

Assuming the grounds are made out,a straightforward divorce will be concluded from issue to decree absolute within 8-16 weeks. This ignores any issues of children or financial settlement. Most of the time will be taken with waiting for court hearing and the effluxion of time between nisi and absolute. It is possible to abridge that 6 week period in exceptional circumstances.

oldoldgit
28th Feb 2007, 05:03
Correct me if I am wrong Roly,
British Citzenship can only be derived from the Mother, So until they are married the baby will be Thai yes/no?

Noi & Nick
28th Feb 2007, 06:13
The law changed on 1st July 2006.

Since then fathers who are British otherwise than by descent can pass on their nationality to their children even if they are not married to the mother.

For how to do it, see Consular Birth Registration (http://www.britishembassy.gov.uk/servlet/Front?pagename=OpenMarket/Xcelerate/ShowPage&c=Page&cid=1068717512679).

oldoldgit
28th Feb 2007, 11:43
Thanks for the information, was quoting from Wifes ILR of August 2005, it seems very expensive for the ladys other half, but then again the Embassy is one big money making machine!! :bah:

Tobias
28th Feb 2007, 12:02
Originally posted by oldoldgit:
... it seems very expensive for the ladys other half, but then again the Embassy is one big money making machine!! :bah: ... better than the UK tax payer having to cough up ;)

oldoldgit
1st Mar 2007, 03:44
So do you think £200.00 to put a signiture to a form fair? in my world it isn't, we should be able to claim back inflated Embassy charges, eg, £500.00 to go to Croydon for ILR, £355.00 by post, I have read about them employing illegal workers, is that how they are able to it without too much expense to the Tax Payer?
Should be similar to claiming back unfair bank charges.

Tobias
1st Mar 2007, 04:28
Why should the UK tax payer pay?

oldoldgit
1st Mar 2007, 05:08
It is obvious that they being British tax payers are being ripped off by the Embassy!! eg, years ago, Wifes friend wanted British passport saw it was £80.00 thought it too much so didn't bother, next time she looked it was £120.00, now it is £280.00+ a test and she is a tax payer!!
BTW, Give your record player a kick ,the needle's stuck ;)

Tobias
1st Mar 2007, 05:25
Originally posted by oldoldgit:
... BTW, Give your record player a kick ,the needle's stuck ;) Indeed - but you still haven't answered why :)

Noi & Nick
1st Mar 2007, 06:09
What follows is my personal opinion. I make no claims as to it's accuracy or otherwise.

A few years ago the government decided that with immigration services, both in UK and at foreign embassies, the principle of funding should be that the user pays.

No one with any sense can argue with that. As Tobias says, why should the taxpayer pay for me to bring my wife and daughter to the UK?

However, my argument is the size of the actual charges, which bear no relation to the actual service provided or the amount of work involved. It seems to me that, to put it simply, the government looked at the total cost of running the visa and immigration services and divided it by the number of applicants for visas, ILR etc. This totally ignores the fact that a large proportion of the cost covers passport and immigration control at the various ports of entry into the UK. Should visa and other applicants pay for this?

Also a large proportion of the work done by the IND is dealing with asylum applications. These are free to the applicant, and are not paid for from general taxation but from the exorbitant fees charged to legitimate immigrants, such as our partners. As is the cost of processing EEA family permits etc.

Unfortunately, the average taxpayer, if asked, would agree that as long as s/he didn't have to pay they don't care that the whole unwieldy system is funded by the out of proportion and completely unfair charges paid by likes of us!

oldoldgit
1st Mar 2007, 07:00
Thank you Meister, I should have known better than to try and stress a point with a Legal Eagle. :bah:

Thaddeus
1st Mar 2007, 08:00
Originally posted by oldoldgit:
Thank you Meister, I should have known better than to try and stress a point with a Legal Eagle. :bah:

Actually, what you should have known better was this.


Hello all,

Its taken me a while to find this site but I've already picked up some invaluable information from previous threads.


Dick

Posts: 2 | Location: Brighton, Sussex | Registered: 27 February 2007


MrDick
Member
Posted 27 February 2007 17:33

oldoldgit
1st Mar 2007, 11:32
Thanks Thaddeus,
I Should have noticed.

MrDick
2nd Mar 2007, 02:58
Being new to any kind of forum it has been interesting watching the debate develope.
As I posted the topic I may as well keep the ball rolling.
I agree that the charges seem excessive. There is probably an attitude from above in the nature of 'you want a visa you pay. Take it or leave it.'
Since there is no real voice to challenge this issue the visa applicants will continue to subsidise other areas of immigration business. When applying for the visa you are too worried about rocking the boat, and after, i would imagine, you are too overwhelmed with paperwork and stress that you have no will to pursue the matter.

Is there anyone out there with the time and inclination to challenge these fees - preferably before I make my application?

Dick

Noi & Nick
2nd Mar 2007, 03:26
Originally posted by MrDick:
Is there anyone out there with the time and inclination to challenge these fees When the in UK fees were first introduced my MP, who was Shadow Immigration Minister at the time, did challenge them. As did many universities whose foreign students were affected, as did many individuals by writing to their MPs.

Unfortunately all this protest was ignored by the government. It can afford to do this because:-
It has a majority.
The majority of voters don't give a toss one way or the other.

Will the next government, which ever party it is, remove these fees or make them fairer? Don't hold your breath!

oldoldgit
4th Mar 2007, 08:51
Originally posted by Tobias:
Why should the UK tax payer pay?
Should the Taxpayer pay for the rescue of the stupid Embassy staff who knew they were going into a dangerous area in Ethiopia and were captured? I would love to see that Bill.

oldoldgit
5th Mar 2007, 03:21
Dick,
Sorry, off topic, but had to get a dig in, after dealing with Embassy for a while you will see that you will have to play their silly games and jump through hoops and pay for the priviledge, nearer the end my wife dreaded going to the Embassy for SV as they had refused her twice before.

-Keith-
5th Mar 2007, 05:09
Actually Oldoldgit, very few SV applications are refused. Poor preparation is usually the reason though.

oldoldgit
5th Mar 2007, 06:48
Misled you, was refused Fiancee visa twice, for no reason to return.
After returning from Fiancee visa, SV not too much trouble as ECO was being a Meadow Lady and was coming the big I am.

Asking what were wife's plans IF!! she gave her SV, told ECO we were Going to Northern Cyprus first then on to UK, Was told IF you get visa for North Cyprus I will give you SV Visa, Showed ECO a Fax from TRNC Consul in London saying no visa needed, so I said forget Cyprus and wife got her SV, We then flew to N/Cyprus with no problems.

That is why my Wife fears the Embassy and I have a chip on my shoulder regarding the staff there.

Mark W
5th Mar 2007, 07:20
Misled you, was refused Fiancee visa twice, for no reason to return.

Humm, a strange reason to refuse a Fiancee Visa as a Fiancee visa is for the Fiancee to settle here. :confused: :confused:

Wires crossed somewhere.

maokaang
5th Mar 2007, 07:25
Misled you, was refused Fiancee visa twice, for no reason to return. That is even more confusing and misleading. To apply for a fiance visa (which is a settlement visa) you have to show you will be getting married and settling in the UK. "No reason to return" is a common refusal for a visit visa, quite the opposite for a fiance visa.

[Edit: Mark posted while I was trying to type and answer the phone at the same time]

oldoldgit
5th Mar 2007, 10:54
Have looked at Wife's passport, sorry to give you all headaches, it was a type C-Visitors Visa in 2003 not a settlement Visa, the SV saga came later. (will keep taking medicine) :confused: :rolleyes:

Noi & Nick
6th Mar 2007, 06:00
She was twice refused a settlement visa; no, that's wrong it was a fiance visa; oops, wrong again it was a visit visa! :crazy:

Sure you've got it right this time?

BTW, 'scuse my ignorance, but what is a "type C-Visitors Visa'?

Also, how do you know what type of visa it was by looking in your wife's passport? When an application is refused there is no mention of what type of visa was applied for in the applicant's passport, merely a small stamp to show an application has been refused. :confused: