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  1. #1
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    Exclamation Thai lady with a British kid- her options

    Hi everyone, Happy new year !!!
    anyway, I need some advise on my situation here, will try to make as short as possible
    im married to a British man and we have a 5 year-old son.We decided to move back to uk. No problems with the boys but I couldn't get a settlement visa as my husband ' s salary doesn't meet the requirement , anyway I got a visitor visa here now. My son is in school and my husband is working...
    It took me 8 months before I get here as some complications with my visa application,
    to make story short, once my visa runs out in June I will reapply for settlement visa again.
    Theres big problem in our marriage now and I don't know if it will work out ( don't want to go into details ) , ...anyway, there's something I would like to ask
    - once I get settlement visa and my marriage ends, what will happens to me?
    Can I continue to live here and work and support my son ?
    If it ends and how can I get my own place to live and survive here ?

    i can't take my son back to Thailand yet as he's very attached to his daddy and his grandma , it will break his heart if I do that.
    ..... A lot happened in 2013 and it's a very long story so I don't want to go into details, I just need some information so I know what's possible for me after all
    thanks in advance for all the replies

  2. #2
    Premium Member sisaket's Avatar
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    Happy new year
    Hope things work out for you , but i think you will have to return to Thailand when your VV runs out and apply from there for settlement visa , are you trying to get a settlement visa and your marriage as already finished ? or are you trying to get a settlement visa while your still married ? and will your husband help you with this ?
    bangkok mags

  3. #3
    Moderator richardb's Avatar
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    Hi I edited your post title check in later in the week much to say but a little late / early in the morning to be of assistance

    Richard
    It takes courage to grow up and turn out to be who you really are

  4. #4
    Forum Regular สมาชิกประจำ sumrit's Avatar
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    Happy New Year.

    I assume you're asking about a settlement visa on the basis that your marriage is going to continue to be successful but you're asking, because of current marriage problems, what would happen to you if your marriage breaks down sometime in the future (after you're in the UK on a settlement visa).

    Firstly, as Sisaket says, when your visit visa finishes you must return to Thailand. You can only apply for a settlement visa from within Thailand after you've returned from your visit.

    Assuming your application is successful you will initially be given a settlement visa that's valid for twenty seven months. At the end of that time you must then apply for Indefinite Leave to Remain (ILR). Amongst other things, when applying for ILR you must show that you are still in a 'successful' marriage with your husband.

    Should your marriage break down before the end of that 27 month period you can remain in the UK FOR THE REMAINDER OF THAT 27 MONTHS but you can't apply for ILR and must leave the UK when your visa expires.

    Should your marriage break down after you have obtained ILR you can remain in the UK indefinitely, providing the UK continues to be your main place of residence (you couldn't, for example, return to live in Thailand and use that ILR to come to the UK for holidays).

    From the moment you arrive in the UK on a settlement visa you are entitled to work to (help to) support your family in the UK but during that initial 27 months you would not be entitled to any state benefits whatsoever.


    Just one other point. As part of your settlement visa application you must pass a basic A1 speaking and listening English language exam. Because of the way it's set up by the examining bodies in Thailand I understand that it would possibly be easier for you to take and pass that exam in the UK. While you're in the UK on your current visit visa you might want to look into that option.

  5. #5
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    Sumrit,
    are you sure she will be entitled to remain in the UK under Settlement if the marriage has broken down?
    My understanding is that this visa is issued on the basis of being married/'living as husband and wife' to a UK settled person. If those circumstances change, then the rules are that the UKBA must be updated. If the updated circumstances no longer meet the criteria for remaining under the settlement visa, I would imagine her visa would be revoked??
    thats my understanding anyways.

    To the OP, I am sorry hear your circumstances. If I were you, I would speak with Citizens Advice Bureau and get advice about the child access etc. You should not remove the children back to Thailand without your husband unless he agrees. You may need some legal guidance on the best way to negotiate a workable plan.

  6. #6
    Forum Regular สมาชิกประจำ
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    Hi sopit
    i'm no legal but we do some very good ones atn this forum from my personal experience when my first marrage broke down to a Thai who was here on a settlement visa, we also had a son, who was only a couple of months old.when i went and sort legal advice they told me that if custody of my son was awarded to my thai wife it was very unlikely she would be deported even though she at that time had no ILR.
    i was awarded custody of our son she remains in the UK and has since remarried i still encourage a once fortnightly contact with his mum although now being nearly 12years old he wants to see his mates more regularly.
    good luck to you but if your marrage does fail ensure you have custody

    - - - - - - - u p d a t e d - - - - - - -

    opps first sentence

    I'm no legal eagle but we do have some very good ones on this forum

  7. #7
    Forum Regular สมาชิกประจำ Boydio's Avatar
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    Is it just me, or is the new title of the thread a bit confusing? I don't understand why the British husband is "not nice".

  8. #8
    Moderator Tobias's Avatar
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    Boydio, let's not take the topic off track, please. There are serious issues raised in the OP and a lady who clearly needs help and assistance. Let's concentrate our efforts on those issues rather than the thread title.

    Many thanks

    Tobias
    T-UK Moderator
    Tobias - โทเบียส

  9. #9
    Moderator richardb's Avatar
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    There is a route to remain or re enter if your marriage breaks down ( I of course hope it does not). It really gets a bit complicated and I would not go down this route without assistance.

    Richard

    Family life as a parent.

    http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/po...e-as-a-parent/

    Relationship requirements
    E-LTRPT.2.2. The child of the applicant must be-
    (a) under the age of 18 years at the date of application, or where the child has turned 18 years of age since the applicant was first granted entry clearance or leave to remain as a parent under this Appendix, must not have formed an independent family unit or be leading an independent life;
    (b) living in the UK; and
    (c) a British Citizen or settled in the UK; or
    (d) has lived in the UK continuously for at least the 7 years immediately preceding the date of application and paragraph EX.1. applies.
    E-LTRPT.2.3. Either-
    (a) the applicant must have sole parental responsibility for the child or the child normally lives with the applicant and not their other parent (who is a British Citizen or settled in the UK); or
    (b) the parent or carer with whom the child normally lives must be-
    (i) a British Citizen in the UK or settled in the UK;
    (ii) not the partner of the applicant (which here includes a person who has been in a relationship with the applicant for less than two years prior to the date of application); and
    (iii) the applicant must not be eligible to apply for leave to remain as a partner under this Appendix.
    E-LTRPT.2.4. (a) The applicant must provide evidence that they have either-
    (i) sole parental responsibility for the child, or that the child normally lives with them; or
    (ii) access rights to the child; and
    (b) The applicant must provide evidence that they are taking, and intend to continue to take, an active role in the child's upbringing.

    At first sight it appears you are excluded as you are here as a visitor but there is an exception EX1

    Section EX: Exception
    EX.1. This paragraph applies if
    (a) (i) the applicant has a genuine and subsisting parental relationship with a child who-
    (aa) is under the age of 18 years, or was under the age of 18 years when the applicant was first granted leave on the basis that this paragraph applied;
    (bb) is in the UK;
    (cc) is a British Citizen or has lived in the UK continuously for at least the 7 years immediately preceding the date of application ;and
    (ii) it would not be reasonable to expect the child to leave the UK; or
















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  10. #10
    Forum Regular สมาชิกประจำ
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    Ex.1
    (a) (cc)
    subsection would void her application as she has not lived in the country for 7 years.

    The legilsation reads as though all of the criteria needs to be achieved as the last bit reads, "And..." not "or".

    There is still the grey area of human rights appeal where the Home Secretary has discretion to grant the application based on individual circumstances.

    The OP asks about what support she would be given...

    Each council has a responsibility to ensure no one is destititute. I appreciate some immigrants are not entititled to state benefit, but this is not the typical tourist benefits claim due to the child/marriage breakdown.

    There are however a number of ethnic minority charities throughout the UK that will give free advice and inform you which support agencies can help that would not be deemed as 'state benefit' under the UKBA laws/guidance.
    Last edited by HappyCar; 2nd Jan 2014 at 19:22.

  11. #11
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    Thanks for the information... I hope my marriage will work out and everything will be ok
    this information helps me make my plan better.... Will see what happens next

  12. #12
    Moderator richardb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HappyCar View Post
    Ex.1
    (a) (cc)
    subsection would void her application as she has not lived in the country for 7 years.
    It is the child who has to be british or lived here seven years

    Quote Originally Posted by HappyCar View Post
    The legilsation reads as though all of the criteria needs to be achieved as the last bit reads, "And..." not "or".
    yes but the preceeding bit does not have an and or and or

    Quote Originally Posted by HappyCar View Post
    There is still the grey area of human rights appeal where the Home Secretary has discretion to grant the application based on individual circumstances.
    Yes kind of though current caselaw says that the rules are a full codification of Human Rights Law but hey we still have application for FLR (O) and para 353 .....exceptional circumstances which mean that removal from the United Kingdom is no longer appropriate.

    Quote Originally Posted by HappyCar View Post
    The OP asks about what support she would be given...

    Each council has a responsibility to ensure no one is destititute......

    ...There are however a number of ethnic minority charities throughout the UK that will give free advice .....
    Spot on mate no women with children in the UK will ever be left destitute .

    I should add that some free ( and paid for ) advice givers aren't ethic minorities ( though their wifes might be)

    I said to Sopit dont go it alone but for a straight forward look at family life as a parent have a look here.

    http://www.freemovement.org.uk/2012/...the-new-rules/

    Richard
    It takes courage to grow up and turn out to be who you really are

  13. #13
    Forum Regular สมาชิกประจำ sumrit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HappyCar View Post
    Sumrit,
    are you sure she will be entitled to remain in the UK under Settlement if the marriage has broken down?
    She would be entitled to remain indefinitely under ILR rules.
    As I said,f the marriage breaks down after ILR is obtained, that person can remain in the UK indefinitely (subject to residency conditions). I personally know of three people who've been in this situation, me/my ex wife included.

    My marriage ended after ten years, my (Thai) mates ended after twelve years and a third couple I know after four years. Another couple I know separated after about three years in the UK, due to her gambling debts. He actually tried to get her removed from the UK and sent back to Thailand. He was told he couldn't. Because she had ILR she was entitled to remain in the UK, even though the marriage had broken down. Incidentally, she stopped gambling and, six months later, they got back together and are still together some two years or so later.
    Quote Originally Posted by HappyCar View Post
    My understanding is that this visa is issued on the basis of being married/'living as husband and wife' to a UK settled person. If those circumstances change, then the rules are that the UKBA must be updated. If the updated circumstances no longer meet the criteria for remaining under the settlement visa, I would imagine her visa would be revoked??
    thats my understanding anyways.
    If the marriage broke down within the initial 27 months, before she obtained ILR, then that person is allowed to remain until the end of that period because the visa is valid until then, and it's at that point that the reassessment is done, not before. Any breakdown within that period could turn out to be temporary.

    If they are still apart when the reassessment (for ILR) is done she will not qualify and be allowed to remain, so must leave the UK.

  14. #14
    Moderator richardb's Avatar
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    Sumrit even if a marriage breaks down within the probationary period she may be able to stay . I have achieved that for a number of local Thai ladies but this lady does not yet have a settlement visa ( and she will be applying ) currently she has a visitors visa.

    Sopit do not be a stranger here. As your future unfolds your sons interests will be paramount

    http://www.ein.org.uk/blog/best-inte...post-july-2012

    Richard
    It takes courage to grow up and turn out to be who you really are

  15. #15
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    Thanks a lot. I'm finding as much information as I can here. One thing I know for sure is that I will not give up on my wee boy...

    - - - - - - - u p d a t e d - - - - - - -

    One more question :-) as I wasn't here for months and my son's been in school for a while and his parent contact is my husband and his career is my mother in law , as my husband is working far away from his mom and only comes to see our son at weekends.. ( don't want to go into details either ) , so I don't have my name in his school form .
    Would this effect me and my situation in any way in the future if the relationship breaks down ?

  16. #16
    Forum Antiquity ของโบราณ bifftastic's Avatar
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    Sopit, I think the first thing you need to do is to get the first visa so that you can stay here.

    After you come back to live here, then you can make sure everything is in place for you to remain in the UK with your son.

    โชกดีครับ
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    "And yet, here you are."

  17. #17
    Forum Regular สมาชิกประจำ sumrit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by richardb View Post
    Sumrit even if a marriage breaks down within the probationary period she may be able to stay . I have achieved that for a number of local Thai ladies
    I do agree with you Richard, but that depends on different individual circumstances doesn't it.

    I was just trying to give a basic answer to the 'before and after ILR scenario' when no other criteria comes into play to try to clarify Happycar's query.

    I understand that having a child in the UK might well mean Sopit would be able to stay, even if her marriage ended within the probationary period, and you would be much better qualified to advise her if that instance arose than I would.

    I'm not, and don't claim to be an expert. I tend to post based purely on my own personal experiences gained over the last twenty years or so.

  18. #18
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    Well we planned to move to uk since 2011 but something happened when my husband and our son flew back to uk while I was waiting for settlement visa which I didn't get dude to financial issues so I came here first with visiting visa. I hope my marriage will work out, I mean it's not finished yet, there's just some issues to sort out
    anyway my husband will help me get the settlement visa...

  19. #19
    Moderator richardb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sopit View Post
    ...... so I don't have my name in his school form .
    Would this effect me and my situation in any way in the future if the relationship breaks down ?
    You always have YOUR ( written or oral ) evidence that you have a relationship with your son but written evidence from schools etc corroborates that ( backs it up )

    Richard

    - - - - - - - u p d a t e d - - - - - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by sumrit View Post
    ..... I tend to post based purely on my own personal experiences gained over the last twenty years or so....
    Nothing wrong with that Sumrit we work with one purpose to have a bit of fun here and to help and support those in Anglo Thai relationships.

    Richard
    It takes courage to grow up and turn out to be who you really are

  20. #20
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    I will contact the school sometimes this week
    anyway, I'm having big problem with my mother in law here. As I say my husband is working away and only comes here at weekends.
    my questions
    is , if I want to leave this house but find someone ( or if there's any organisation ) that can help me with a room to sleep or stay until my visa runs out.
    im very unhappy here, but I can't leave my son and go back to Thailand . I have to be around him in any case
    im in Littlehampton at the moment...

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