Uk visa

**Imshi** · 1st Apr 2018, 00:27

Any advice please. I have a friend of 8 years who would like to visit the Uk. She house her own house and employment and I have never financially supported her. We exchange presents and talk most days on the phone and I visit Thailand a few times a year. I believe she has all the requirements for applying for a Uk visa but isn’t able to fund her visit. To that end I would fund her flight and accommodate her at my home. However, I believe there are “ desired” requirements for a sponsor. I have a large enough income to satisfy that requirement and funds to support my friends stay in the Uk for a month. But I have been told that in order to meet all requirements I will need to evidence that I have a lump of money in my bank account. My question is, how much money will I need to satisfy the visa requirements? There is no hurry, it is just something my friend would like to do. She is able to evidence her status in Thailand, EG has property, a family and employment which her boss is willing to confirm along with an agreement that her job will continue after her holiday. I am more concerned about the requirements I need to evidence. Any advice please.

**Flip** · 1st Apr 2018, 01:47

What you need to act as sponsor is:

1. Proof of your relationship, records of regular contact, details of your visits to Thailand with evidence that you were actually together - i.e. photos, evidence of any joint travel etc. etc.

2. Evidence of your home showing its is adequate for the use intended and, if its not yours - your parents for example, permission from the owner/registered tenant for your friend to stay.

3. You do not necessarily need to have a 'lump of money' in your bank account. What you need to do is convince an ECO that you have an amount sufficient to cover all the costs of her visit and that must be evidenced. If you are in regular employment you need to show proof of income and that the amount needed to cover the cost of your friend's visit is free and available for that purpose - i.e. savings. If you are not in regular employment or cannot prove your income then its better if you do have a substantial amount in a savings account. Beware of opening an account and putting a large amount in it then making the visa application straight away.

This is all from memory, I believe there are official guidelines on sponsorship.

**wunderbar** · 1st Apr 2018, 09:17

Have visitors visas become easier to obtain recently ?? I ask because few days ago a girl obtained one in the multi entry format who would expect to tick every decline box in an ECO tick sheet
Am totally startled she fits absolutely none of the basic criteria but she does have a baby with an English lad of about 18 months old (baby is not coming uk when she flies on the 4th April)
Wondered if that tipped the scales on this occasion. Am on her facebook so have been able to watch the process from start to finish

**Flip** · 1st Apr 2018, 10:40

Originally Posted by wunderbar

Have visitors visas become easier to obtain recently ??

I doubt it but as I've said on many occasions, it can be a lottery. I too have seen people get a V V who I would have sworn had no chance whilst others are refused when they seem to fit all the requirements.

**rasg** · 2nd Apr 2018, 00:19

If you say in sponsor letter of the visa application that you are taking your GF on a whistle stop tour of the 5 star hotels around the UK for a month and show an income of £1200 a month and only £1000 in the bank, you are not likely to get a VV for your GF.

If on the other hand you say that she will be staying at your house for a month and you will be making the odd trip to the coast and show £2000 in the bank you are far more likely to be believed.

You don't have to lay out much of an itinerary but if you do, you need to show you have the funds to back it up. That's all. For my now wife's first VV I just said that we would be making the odd trip to London and the South the coast and meeting my family. I gave them no info about my wife's bank statements etc. Just explained that she was paid in cash and the money was sent home to her family or to pay the rent and she had a few thousand baht each week to live on. It was all true and that is the main trick. Telling the truth.

Stuffing money into her account is the worst thing you can do unless she can show where the money came from. If she is earning 10,000 baht a month and then £1000 lands in her acocunt the ECO will want to know where it came from. Sadly most Thais believe, because of the Thai grapevine that it is a requirement and believe that padding a bank account just before applying for a VV, will guarantee a visa. It does the exact opposite. Many Thai visa companies give the same advice too which muddies the waters even further.

I think that one of the most critical things in a VV is the sponsor letter along with the reason to return. A job is perfect as long as her employer backs up what has been said in the visa application. Quite a few don't. IMHO I think that the first VV is the first step on the road to the employer losing a good member of staff. The next visa application is likely to be a settlement visa for the GF's to get married and move to the UK.

I don't think a VV application is a lottery at all. Provide good evidence that your GF will return to Thailand after her trip, sufficient funds to pay for it, show she has a place to stay and show you have been in a relationship together for a while and she will get the visa.

The other trick is not to be over ambitious by requesting a 5 or 6 month holiday. She will be unlikely to get the visa. Holidays in Thailand for most employees are pretty short and requesting a month as my GF did back in May 2015, after only meeting in early February and it went through with no problems.

Her second VV in October was also fine despite us extending her first trip to 18 weeks. Because we had a valid reason why she stayed a lot longer than originally requested and explained why in the second application, it wasn't an issue.

I don't think they are any easier or more difficult than they were if you put a good, solid application together.

**wunderbar** · 2nd Apr 2018, 09:02

Originally Posted by rasg

I don't think a VV application is a lottery at all. Provide good evidence that your GF will return to Thailand after her trip

How can you provide good evidence that she will return after the trip !
In reference to the Girl I mentioned earlier in thread shes on Thai international right now Monday lunchtime flight and was talking to her late yesterday as my ex wife is going to assist her on her first few days in uk.
By her own admission they cannot believe they got the visa she is absolutely potless as is the boyfriend apart from monthly low salary.
Knowing her for years I have a good idea as to whats going to happen on expiry of the VV but we'll see

**rasg** · 2nd Apr 2018, 10:50

Originally Posted by wunderbar

How can you provide good evidence that she will return after the trip !
In reference to the Girl I mentioned earlier in thread shes on Thai international right now Monday lunchtime flight and was talking to her late yesterday as my ex wife is going to assist her on her first few days in uk.
By her own admission they cannot believe they got the visa she is absolutely potless as is the boyfriend apart from monthly low salary.
Knowing her for years I have a good idea as to whats going to happen on expiry of the VV but we'll see

By showing her ties to Thailand with reasons to go back. A job to return to is one of the best but the employer has to on board and happy to receive a phone call from the ECO. Give an ECO all of the information that they need and they won’t need to call.

The people you mention obviously put a good, solid application together and didn’t make many mistakes that others do. Without seeing the whole of the application it's difficult to say.

It's not about money, although that helps a bit. Stuffing money into a GF's bank account is a no no if she can’t account for it. Sending money to her in Thailand where she is totally reliant on it to make ends meet each month, will lead to a refusal too for a first VV.

IMHO it's better not to give too many details of the GF's bank account if possible. The ECOs pick them apart and then they call and often the whole thing unravels when the GF is unable to confirm all that has been said in the application.

Make sure you do the whole of the application yourself and just get your GF's to gather it all together. Write a really good sponsor letter and tell the truth...

Make sure that the GF is able to confirm all that has been said in the application. My wife had a "cheat sheet" in her bag in case she received a call. It had the names of my family on it. My full name (I have 4). My parents names. My birthday and date of birth. The date we met. Her own employer details. How long a holiday the visa application requested with the dates. Etc, etc. She never needed it but it would have meant that she had all of the information to hand if called.

**wunderbar** · 2nd Apr 2018, 10:57

^^
I think the first line went above your head somehow lol. You cannot provide evidence that shes returned can you or shes going to. You can only offer reasons for her to return which we hope are accepted.
I applied in 1996 the first application was declined no reason to return. The 2nd application for her 6 weeks later identical offerings in the application and went through no problem. As flip says different day different result

**Tobias** · 2nd Apr 2018, 11:18

Originally Posted by wunderbar

^^
I think the first line went above your head somehow lol. You cannot provide evidence that shes returned can you or shes going to. You can only offer reasons for her to return which we hope are accepted. ...

Which is exactly what rasg meant.

**Flip** · 2nd Apr 2018, 12:10

The OP has not asked questions about the requirements for his gf. He has asked about what evidence he needs to provide.

**rasg** · 2nd Apr 2018, 16:09

Originally Posted by wunderbar

^^
I think the first line went above your head somehow lol. You cannot provide evidence that shes returned can you or shes going to. You can only offer reasons for her to return which we hope are accepted.
I applied in 1996 the first application was declined no reason to return. The 2nd application for her 6 weeks later identical offerings in the application and went through no problem. As flip says different day different result

Bearing in mind that this was a long time ago, are you telling us that you submitted an identical application for a visa, six weeks after being refused with identical information? Really?

**Flip** · 2nd Apr 2018, 17:17

Originally Posted by rasg

I don't think a VV application is a lottery at all. Provide good evidence that your GF will return to Thailand after her trip, sufficient funds to pay for it, show she has a place to stay and show you have been in a relationship together for a while and she will get the visa.

Sorry rasg but that is simply not true. As I have said many times, I've both been personally involved in and seen applications from other people that have either been refused without good reason or been granted a visa when they shouldn't have. Human nature is such that people are different and that goes for ECO's too.

Explain this to me then, and I promise you there is nothing more to it.........English guy, decent work record and income, sufficient proof of relationship and accommodation at his parents house, with his Thai girfriend for about 6 months - 2 visits. Thai girlfriend, not working, no income at all (on paper), lives with a friend in Bangkok. No work history, standard basic education, no savings, no children and visited her family up in Isaan around twice a year. Never had a V V before nor ever travelled outside Thailand. I.E. no reasons to return at all and none submitted. V V granted at first attempt - as were 2 subsequent ones. The applicant's BF is known to me personally and was a member here. I remember them submitting the application, he just said "lets give it a go" - visa granted. That is a clear 'no reason to return' application and 8 times out of 10 or with a different ECO it would have been refused.

I've seen people with plenty of so called reasons to return refused a visa on the grounds of insufficient reason to return - you of all people should know that ECO's use that old chestnut when they are simply not happy about something but its not a valid reason for refusal. Why? Because they know very well that its subjective.

**rasg** · 2nd Apr 2018, 18:42

We've had the same discussion before and back then I said that we would have to agree to disagree.

IMHO I think the sponsor letter is critical and last August I helped a couple on another forum who had been refused. They were planning to get married later that year but wanted her to give the UK weather a try and meet the boyfriend's family. She had no job and only family as ties to Thailand and her only income was for her boyfriend each month. The only thing that was changed in the whole application was the sponsor letter which I rewrote and the visa was then granted.

I don't believe it's a lottery. Put a good solid application together and the visa will be granted.

A very small percentage of visit visas are refused. Most are because of a poorly put together application, telling fibs or not supplying all of the information needed. Also quite a few because the applicant is poorly prepared when the ECO calls and stumbles over basic info that she should be able to confirm.

**Samsung** · 2nd Apr 2018, 19:18

we all seem to have made a mistake The op does not mention girlfriend as i read it he says friend ,

**Flip** · 2nd Apr 2018, 19:24

Originally Posted by rasg

Put a good solid application together and the visa will be granted.

Yes we have had this conversation before but you still keep giving out the same information. Of course you have a right to an opinion but to say 'the visa will be granted' is just plain wrong. Both myself and Wunderbar have given you examples of visas applications where the outcomes have been questionable. Those are facts, not opinions which is why I object to your wording.

Of course, a well presented application will have a far better chance of success but there is no guarantee of that - ECO's have gut feelings, hunches, call them what you will but they do not always get it right. If they did there would be no appeals (where appeals are allowed) that overturn the original decision. I can categorically state that all the V V refusals that I have seen where the decision seems wrong, the ECO has used 'insufficient reason to return' to refuse the visa. Yet as I have pointed out, some people don't provide any evidence of a reason to return and get their visa. How would you account for that then?

You will note that I don't say 'it is a lottery', I say, 'it can be a lottery'. I don't claim to be an authority on the subject but I do speak from experience.

**rasg** · 2nd Apr 2018, 22:14

You do seem to be claiming to be an authority on the subject which is why we will have to agree to disagree. We’ve flogged this dead horse before.

Like you, I am going by experience. Every visit visa refusal where I have seen the whole application, it is fairly obvious why it was refused and most refusal notices are quite detailed as to why the visa was refused. Certainly the those I've seen in the last year where an application has been picked apart.

If you haven’t seen the whole visa application it's difficult to pin down the exact reason. Then you have the "my friend was refused because..." brigade who are just going on hearsay.

**Flip** · 2nd Apr 2018, 23:49

Originally Posted by rasg

You do seem to be claiming to be an authority on the subject which is why we will have to agree to disagree. We’ve flogged this dead horse before.

If you haven’t seen the whole visa application it's difficult to pin down the exact reason. Then you have the "my friend was refused because..." brigade who are just going on hearsay.

I have made it quite clear on each occasion that I am talking from personal experience or where I have knowledge of the application. I don't see how that is 'claiming to be an authority on the subject' - pure attempt at point scoring on your behalf. But I note you fail to answer the question from my last post.

I am also very aware that there is often more to a refusal than what is first reported - we've seen that on many occasions here. The examples I use are where I know exactly what was contained within the application.

You have only been on this forum a little under 3 years, you may not have looked back at all the reports of failed visa applications but there was one a little while back, you may have seen it - not sure. The sponsor had sent full financial details but the ECO failed to spot them. Is that the applicant's fault then or did the ECO get it wrong? Of course you will launch into a defence about how everything should have been clearly labelled. I could not say whether it was or not on that application but as the details were submitted and referred to in the covering letter, the owness was on the ECO to discover them, not refuse the application stating that no details had been supplied.

Other older members here will remember that there was once a time when you could contact the ECM (if you knew how) when you thought an ECO had erred. Some decisions were reviewed and reversed.

It is not a matter of agreeing to disagree, ECO's can and do, get it wrong sometimes, fact - and they get it wrong both ways. There is no such thing as a guaranteed V V application, no matter how well that application is put together - there is simply a much better chance.

**Samsung** · 3rd Apr 2018, 08:00

she knows the law and wouldnt want to jepodise any future visits or the relationship ,thats what i put on my wifes visa was granted .and to be honest now with biometrics and the uk going towards a cashless society that would only leave the black market open for non return visitors ,no health care no dental no pension no legit job ,no bank account ,may as well stay in thailand at least its sunny.

**wunderbar** · 3rd Apr 2018, 08:02

Originally Posted by rasg

Bearing in mind that this was a long time ago, are you telling us that you submitted an identical application for a visa, six weeks after being refused with identical information? Really?

yes because despite not supposedly entering into conversation with applicants after a vistors refusal (may have changed now) i managed to ask what was wrong with the application apart from the no reason to return excuse. He managed to say that we had not known each other that long in a few months. Fair enough we waited 6 weeks and 1 day (or that was date given) and it was accepted that day. Identical in content bar from me adding that I had redecorated the house. Outcome granted.
As we subsequently married the decision was correct. Came back to the embassy 7 months later with the full application and I swear she was in there 90 seconds came back out with me thinking what the hells gone wrong she said nothing just wait here 30 minutes they go to put visa in passport. That was it lol done and dusted. Divorced now but good friends she lives in London

**Samsung** · 3rd Apr 2018, 08:20

maybe this should be added for future reasons to return seems legit to me
,no health care no dental no pension no legit job ,no bank account ,may as well stay in thailand at least its sunny.