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  1. #1
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    Default Increase to Immigration Health Surcharge gives NHS extra funding

    We do not inherit the Earth from our ancestors; we borrow it from our children.

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    Scandalous we already pay for this in our taxes. Double charging at its worst!

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    What about all the others that get over here and don’t pay nothing


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    Moderator Tobias's Avatar
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    I support this move, foreign nationals who chose to live here should contribute to the cost of the NHS. Once Brexit occurs those from the EEA will also have to pay the NHS surcharge and/or pay for NHS treatment.

    Quote Originally Posted by Carl View Post
    Scandalous we already pay for this in our taxes. Double charging at its worst!
    Well no, whilst we might have contributed to the NHS through our taxes and NI contributions for ourselves and offspring, our non-British partners have not. Once an individual is legally 'settled' in the UK then they will no longer contribute via the surcharge. £400 per annum is a bargain.
    Tobias - โทเบียส

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tobias View Post
    . £400 per annum is a bargain.
    I doubt there will be many members who are going through the visa process will agree with you.

    The way they have been increasing visa fees and now the NHS surcharge is nothing but disgraceful, we are certainly be targeted as soft touches.

    Paying the EU in excess of £600m to treat UK nationals yet we are only claiming back about 10% to treat EU nationals, sums it up.

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    It puts the price up significantly for any future settlement visa applications.
    So at least £1500 for visa and then £1200 surcharge for someone wanting to live in UK. Then add the rubbish conversation rates and it’s higher.

    My wife’s next visa stage will be ILR so hopefully this won’t effect us.

    The hospital costs of having our baby were prob more than the IHS and she asked me when we had to pay hospital fee so I get your point Tobias.

    It is those who followed the rules to enter and remain in the UK legally who have to pay out more as it’s easy to target them.
    It also makes it look like the government is doing something about the NHS and immigration as well.
    Give it a few more years and I’m sure the IHS will go up again.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dsw727 View Post
    The hospital costs of having our baby were prob more than the IHS and she asked me when we had to pay hospital fee so I get your point Tobias.
    Its a valid point, lets just hope we don't have an exodus of NHS nursing staff from outside the EU returning home. I doubt the government have been getting the full backing of nurse leaders with the NHS surcharge, let alone the increase.
    Last edited by Greg / Pairin; 11th Oct 2018 at 20:46.

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    I have paid taxes all my working life and never been out of work. The contract I have with the government is that they will educate my child and treat my family when ill. In so many ways the government are breaking that contract. When my wife comes on a settlement visa she intends to work and to pay tax. Will they deduct the proportion of tax that goes to the NHS as she has already paid until she is "legally" settled. With your sense of justice Tobias I am surprised you aren't outraged. A £600 increase in the cost of a settlement visa is completely unjustifiable. It is another notch in the hostile environment our government wish to create for our partners.

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    You don’t have a contract with the government, you have an obligation to pay tax. Foreign nationals choose to come to the UK and they should therefore contribute to the cost of services they have access to.

    I do not see an injustice, there would be an injustice if foreigners were allowed to come to the UK and not contribute. Once a foreigner is legally settled (and that means they have ILR/ILE/PR) then they will no longer have to pay the NHS surcharge.

    The increase is justifiable, according to government the cost of providing NHS treatment to those who pay the NHS surcharge is equivalent to £470 per person per year, hopefully that will be recovered in future increases. The £400 per year is an absolute bargain, proper health insurance would cost a hell of a lot more.

    Why should the British taxpayer pay for the healthcare of foreign nationals who choose to live here?
    Tobias - โทเบียส

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    Tobias I think you are wrong governments do have a contract with their citizens, one of the problems we have in society is that the government (of either colour) has been trying to change the post war settlement.

    Foreign nationals with a right to work and to recourse to public funds. Will be paying into the system through taxation and almost certainly even if low waged be paying more than £470. Every piece of research carried out recently has shown that migrants have a positive economic contribution ie they pay more into the system than they take out. So they are already paying their health insurance as hard working family members.

    you chose to ignore my question as to whether the nation insurance and income tax our partners pay will be discounted the Health surcharge as it is being paid in advance. It is unjust to charge someone twice for the same service.

    As for your point about health insurance I prefer to put my trust in the NHS. I have been offered free health care insurance by my employer but have always refused it. So I would not know the prices, But I do know I wouldn't buy it twice.
    Last edited by Carl; 12th Oct 2018 at 01:06. Reason: typo

  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carl View Post
    Foreign nationals with a right to work and to recourse to public funds. Will be paying into the system through taxation and almost certainly even if low waged be paying more than £470. Every piece of research carried out recently has shown that migrants have a positive economic contribution ie they pay more into the system than they take out. So they are already paying their health insurance as hard working family members.

    you chose to ignore my question as to whether the nation insurance and income tax our partners pay will be discounted the Health surcharge as it is being paid in advance. It is unjust to charge someone twice for the same service.

    As for your point about health insurance I prefer to put my trust in the NHS. I have been offered free health care insurance by my employer but have always refused it. So I would not know the prices, But I do know I wouldn't buy it twice.
    Sorry. You are so wrong about the idea that low paying migrants somehow have a positive economic contribution. They simply don't. And reading your previous post where you are waiting and hoping for a Corbyn government. You need to hope and pray that he isn’t voted in if you think we are having a hard time now.

    You might be wishing that you had taken that free private healthcare from your company. Corbyn and McDonnell will be abolishing it given the opportunity along with many other things.

    If your wife is working and on the minimum wage earning (£227.88) she will pay no income tax at all and £7.91 in NIC. (No NIC on the first £162.00 of earnings).

    If, God forbid, something happened to your wife that meant she needed long term care, she will be covered by the NHS. My brother in law was dragged under a skip lorry and crushed 8 or 9 years ago and had to be helicoptered into a London hospital. The bill to put him back together again would have been way in excess of £300,000. Your wife would be covered.

    I am not happy having to pay double the NHS surcharge that we paid for my wife's first FLR but it is still a bargain. and I know, if the worse did happen, she will be treated.

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    Agree it is a fair price, but I also think all non uk people should pay. Even al the ones that are being brought over here and housed should pay, but I bet they don’t, I bet they don’t even have to take the English test. Every should pay


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    Quote Originally Posted by Tobias View Post
    Why should the British taxpayer pay for the healthcare of foreign nationals who choose to live here?
    more apt I think
    I'm ONE of the 52%

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg / Pairin View Post
    I doubt there will be many members who are going through the visa process will agree with you...
    Perhaps, but there are millions of UK taxpayers who will. The NHS is under a lot of financial strain, it is only right that those foreign nationals who choose to come and live here contribute to it.
    Tobias - โทเบียส

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    Tobias you may well be quite well paid and these costs may mean nothing to you but if you are on a pension or a low income these above inflation rises may appear to be quite a shock..and leave you wondering how you will cope with them..
    Not every non EU foreign national spouse of a UK citizen is working.They may be over 60 and be totally dependent on their spouse's pension or low income..These rises cause a lot of hardship.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carl View Post
    ... you chose to ignore my question as to whether the nation insurance and income tax our partners pay will be discounted the Health surcharge as it is being paid in advance. It is unjust to charge someone twice for the same service...
    I didn't ignore it, I thought it was tacitly answered. Why should a foreign national receive special discounts on tax and National Insurance? That wouldn't be fair on the UK taxpayer. As far as the people on this forum are concerned, their partners will not even be contributing to the national purse for many months if not years after arrival, if at all!

    From the very first moment an individual arrives in the UK for a 'settled purpose' they are automatically entitled to NHS treatment without payment at the point of service. At that point they have made no contributions and may not be making any for a considerable period. Why should they be entitled to totally free NHS treatment when those hard working residents of the UK have paid their taxes and NI contributions for years?

    The cost of health insurance that would provide the same cover for treatment provided by the NHS would be calculated in the thousands of pounds per year, much, much more than the £400 per year those coming to the UK are being asked to pay.
    Tobias - โทเบียส

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    With the same reasoning why should a refugee or asylum seeker be entitled to free NHS treatment and social security payments.And also with the same reasoning why should people who have never worked and used the system to get money be entitled to free NHS treatment.?

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    A refugee is a person who has been forced to leave their country in order to escape war, persecution, or natural disaster. Those seeking asylum must be treated humanely whilst awaiting their fate. When they arrive here they are likely to have no wealth or assets. They are afforded basic rights to ensure they can survive and receive any necessary medical treatment.

    As for those who have never worked, if they are British (or legally settled) then the government must provide them with what is necessary - but that is wholly irrelevant when it comes to foreign nationals contributing to the national purse for services they have access to.

    It's okay using the 'unfair' card, or the 'can't afford it' card - but the £400 contribution is less than the cost of a flight to most places in the world. I notice my question keeps being ignored: why should the UK taxpayer pay for the medical treatment of foreigners who choose to come here?
    Tobias - โทเบียส

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg / Pairin View Post
    Its a valid point, lets just hope we don't have an exodus of NHS nursing staff from outside the EU returning home. I doubt the government have been getting the full backing of nurse leaders with the NHS surcharge, let alone the increase.
    Reported today that The Royal College of Nursing is asking the Gvt to exempt from the NHS Surcharge those non EEA nurses who the NHS recruits from their own countries. and according to the prime minister they are low skilled as the majority will not be earning anywhere near the £30K /yr.

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    "I notice my question keeps being ignored: why should the UK taxpayer pay for the medical treatment of foreigners who choose to come here?"

    These foreigners as you call them are spouses generally of British citizens and they are usually brought here to settle by their husbands.

    By the same argument why should my taxes pay for all the transport infrastructure being put into the South East of England when the North gets didly squat..?

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