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  1. #1
    Furniture เฟอร์นิเจอร์
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    Default Shootings in New Zealand

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-47578798

    So sad. I lived in New Zealand for many years this will rock the country to the core. This is not what New Zealand is about. Nowhere is safe anymore.

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    Moderator Tobias's Avatar
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    It’s the kind of thing that happens when far right extremists are allowed to go unchecked.
    Tobias - โทเบียส

  3. #3
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    Considering some of the outrages that have happened in Europe and elsewhere, I'm surprised there hasn't been more like this but I really cannot understand the thinking of anyone who commits such an atrocity. On the news tonight though, it was stated that 1 in 4 foiled terror plots were planned by right wing extremists.

    However much you may hate a particular ethnic or religious group - why would you target innocent people, blaming them for other terrorist attacks? Senseless!

    This man's (or group's) clear aim is revenge but all it does it make him (them) no different from the Islamic terrorists he has referred to in his posts. You cannot say a particular type of behaviour is wrong and do the same yourself. A terrorist is a terrorist - no matter what their race, creed or colour.

  4. #4
    Premium Member caller's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tobias View Post
    It’s the kind of thing that happens when far right extremists are allowed to go unchecked.
    I'm not sure that's fair or right. Even NZ monitors known right wing extremists, as do most Countries. But this guy, just as the 'lilywhites' from the Muslim community that have committed atrocities in the UK, was apparently on no-one's radar. Certainly not Australia's and New Zealand's, according to statements made by both Countries. We have often heard it's the type of scenario that Countries fear most.

    Of course, whether he turns out to be as unknown as claimed, will be learnt in due course, which could change things!

    And for reference, I only used the analogy with what has happened in the UK, because I haven't the time or inclination to research details of other similar 'far right extremists' who I know have also committed atrocities.
    'Tis me

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    I havent read whats happened but can get the gist .
    Maybe Blair and Bush didnt help matters seeing what they got away with .

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    Quote Originally Posted by caller View Post
    I'm not sure that's fair or right...
    In what way?

    Here’s another nasty stabbing incident apparently motivated or inspired by the far right.

    Police treating Surrey stabbing as a terrorist incident http://news.sky.com/story/police-tre...ident-11668741
    Last edited by Tobias; 17th Mar 2019 at 18:28.
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  7. #7
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    Like i said i havent read to much about this but from the headlines its a Lone wolf with a few screws loose ,There is a difference between jihad attacks and lone wolf idiots ,one is vastly organised the other well no one can predict or would have known .
    It is such a shame as hundreds are affected by this children waiting for there parents to come home and vice visa words can not describe such a monster i feel for all affected and this takes all the good work done in the last few years backwards .
    A eye for a eye now i see, thank you very much you not right .
    Last edited by Samsung; 17th Mar 2019 at 19:26.

  8. #8
    Premium Member caller's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tobias View Post
    In what way?
    Because you're saying such incidents are the result of far right extremists being allowed to go 'unchecked' and I don't think they are, where they have already come to the attention of the authorities. But if they're not known, how can that be done? Nor does it guarantee such monitoring will prevent such attacks, as has been proved with terrorists of all creeds and fancy.

    I personally wouldn't object if all such persons were removed from the streets to stop any such atrocities taking place, but that wouldn't be acceptable in the UK and I suspect that would just make the situation worse, apart from it being approved in the event of an emergency. I'm sure there will be a law to cover such a scenario somewhere.
    Last edited by caller; 18th Mar 2019 at 08:25.
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    There are times when all of us have to face the fact that where there are human beings, there are going to be acts of pure evil such as these.

    I remember walking through a sports shop in Kingston, twenty-plus years ago, and hearing the radio report the Thomas Hamilton shootings. I had to take a seat, such was the impact of what I was hearing. They had him/it on the radar for various things but nothing could prepare them for that. A complete loner in society who had spent all his free time plotting to destroy a very easy target.

    To kill children goes beyond any crime imaginable.

  10. #10
    Veteran ผู้มีประสบการณ์ prikphet's Avatar
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    I just find it incredible that semi or fully automatic weapons can be bought legally in any country, I mean what legitimate purpose do they serve outside of War ?

  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by Barnet View Post
    There are times when all of us have to face the fact that where there are human beings, there are going to be acts of pure evil such as these.

    I remember walking through a sports shop in Kingston, twenty-plus years ago, and hearing the radio report the Thomas Hamilton shootings. I had to take a seat, such was the impact of what I was hearing. They had him/it on the radar for various things but nothing could prepare them for that. A complete loner in society who had spent all his free time plotting to destroy a very easy target.

    To kill children goes beyond any crime imaginable.
    There were many signs that Thomas Hamilton was mentally unstable and the police did nothing.

    http://www.scotsman.com/news/reveale...acre-1-1098980

    It seems that the security services in NZ were the same. In the New Zealand massacre the killer used Twitter to promote a 'manifesto of hate' against Muslims. There we signs of what was likely to happen and the police did nothing.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by rasg View Post
    It seems that the security services in NZ were the same. In the New Zealand massacre the killer used Twitter to promote a 'manifesto of hate' against Muslims. There we signs of what was likely to happen and the police did nothing.
    I'm happy to stand corrected, but wasn't that just before he started shooting. I read somewhere, it was 10 minutes?
    'Tis me

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    Quote Originally Posted by prikphet View Post
    I just find it incredible that semi or fully automatic weapons can be bought legally in any country, I mean what legitimate purpose do they serve outside of War ?
    Totally agree but on the news tonight it was stated that much like the USA, NZ has a powerful gun lobby. I'd be interested to see what (if any) justification they put forward for members of the public being able to buy assault rifles - there is none.

    I'm a member of a gun club in Thailand. Several members have similar rifles but they cannot take them home, they have to stay at the club and that's the only place where they can be used. I don't know if that's Thai law or club rules - never asked.

    The range also has several assault rifles that can be rented. I enjoy spending time at the shooting range but I have no intention of owning a gun - there is no need. Everything I want from shooting is available 'by the hour'. That is all that's needed so let's see why the NZ gun lobby say they need to own and keep such weapons at home.
    Last edited by Flip; 18th Mar 2019 at 23:44.

  14. #14

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    I went to a range close to Patong when I first went to Thailand but it's there to fleece the tourists nothing much more. Very disappointed. They wanted so much to shoot 45 or 9 mm that I ended up plinking with a 22 for half an hour. They take a photo of you and want £5 for it. Really poor quality.

    The laws in Thailand on pistols in Thailand are fairly lax from what I have read. Semi automatic rifles, I have no idea.

    The laws in NZ allowed the nutter to have two or three semi automatic rifles and from what I have read there is no restriction on the number. Not sure why somebody would need that many.

    Pre 1997 I owned half a dozen pistols of various calibres before the government with support from the opposition banned the lot with a few exceptions after Thomas Hamilton blew a gasket. Our shooting teams have to go abroad to shoot 22 pistols.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by rasg View Post
    I went to a range close to Patong when I first went to Thailand but it's there to fleece the tourists nothing much more. Very disappointed. They wanted so much to shoot 45 or 9 mm that I ended up plinking with a 22 for half an hour. They take a photo of you and want £5 for it. Really poor quality.
    Being Patong, I guess that goes with the territory. Our club is well run (ex Thai Army Major) and very relaxed - not in terms of safety, and has decent equipment to rent at reasonable prices or you can bring your own and just use the facilities.

  16. #16
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    I remember the stories of him being under suspicion etc, etc, what I meant to say was, they could never have predicted that he was capable of what he did.

    I have no idea what to suggest they do. If they arrest people based upon suspicions/potential wrong-doings it might prevent such atrocities, however it could just send people underground and give the authorities no clue at all.

    I honestly think that if some nutcase, evil, twisted psycho wants to do this they will find a way.

    I'm all for banning guns outright, along with many other weapons but I can see acid, petrol, home made bombs replacing them.

  17. #17
    Premium Member Gary & Nok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tobias View Post
    Police treating Surrey stabbing as a terrorist incident http://news.sky.com/story/police-tre...ident-11668741
    Mr T your link does not work.

    But how odd, yet again, that a so called "Far Right" stabbing incidents is called a terrorist incidents yet when a certain religion does something to others they are just "incidents".

    Just saying
    I'm ONE of the 52%

  18. #18
    Premium Member caller's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary & Nok View Post
    yet when a certain religion does something to others they are just "incidents".
    I have noticed the term 'jihadist' incidents or terrorism being used.
    'Tis me

  19. #19
    Moderator Tobias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary & Nok View Post
    Mr T your link does not work.

    But how odd, yet again, that a so called "Far Right" stabbing incidents is called a terrorist incidents yet when a certain religion does something to others they are just "incidents".

    Just saying
    Not all crimes committed by those of Asian descent or the followers of Islam are terrorist crimes, when such crimes are terrorist crimes they are classified as such. It is exactly the same for crimes committed by non-Asian, non-followers of Islam - thos crimes are only considered terrorist crimes when the evidence suggests it is.

    The far right movement promotes hatred and intolerance, and they too have terrorists among their ranks. Terrorism is not just about Islam extremism, it also includes far raight extremism. As far as the vast majority of the world is concerned, both are evil and need to be weeded out.
    Tobias - โทเบียส

  20. #20
    Premium Member ash's Avatar
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    Fact is there are evil individuals in the world and these come in all kinds of packaging white black yellow and in all religions Muslim Christian etc.

    I prefer to call them scum and genuinely support having them put down like the animals they are.

    The hardest part is for each of these people there are thousands who are decent law abiding of the same race and/or faith we cannot blame those for the crimes of the others.
    Human beings are seventy percent water, and with some the rest is collagen

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